FOR SERIOUS SCALE MODEL BUILDERS ONLY:
If you’re a serious museum-quality scale modeler and are interested in some pretty cool TIDAL WAVE B-24D markings decals, I have a few of the following decal sets available. PYN-up Decals are universally acknowledged as the finest scale model aircraft decals ever produced, and feature photo-realistic nose art markings. These decal sets are intended for experienced modelers only, and are sure to make your model the centerpiece of admiration in any collection of models.
When you click the "Add To Goodies Bag" link you’ll go to the checkout page for my "Fine Art of Decals" website. Billing is handled through Asphaleia Business Systems, which is the name that will appear on your credit card or PayPal account.
1/48 Scale
PYN-up B-24 Ploesti Heroes #1. Of the many, many famous Liberators that participated in the famous low level bombing mission against the oil refineries at Ploesti, Romania, one of the most famous (or infamously maligned) was Lt Brian W. Flavelle’s B-24D-70-CO "Wongo Wongo" from the 513 BS/376 BG. Wongo and her crew are fully entitled to be called "Ploesti Heroes" even though they did not make it to Ploesti. It was the lead aircraft of the second section in the 376th Bomb Group formation enroute to Ploesti. The victim of a significant historical inaccuracy (some would say cover up), the less than expected results of the first wave of B-24s at Ploesti was attributed at the time by the Air Force to the loss of this crew, which was purported to the the "lead plane" carrying the "lead navigator." For unknown reasons, just short of the island of Corfu south of the east coast of Greece, Wongo stalled, then dove into the sea and exploded. Although the historical record shows Flavelle and his young navigator were the LEADs for the entire formation and therefore caused the various screw-ups that occurred later, this has been thoroughly debunked by both Colonels Keith Compton (376th commander) and John Kane (98th commander) in later years. In a 2000 interview, Compton clearly stated he flew the mission lead plane with Brigadier General Uzal Ent, the mission commander, aboard, and that he in fact led the entire mission under General Ent’s orders. The full story of this pathetic episode is told in the instruction sheet. The second Ploesti hero is B-24D-65-CO, 566 BS 389 BG, "Fightin’ Sam," flown by Capt Tom Conroy. "Sam" was nearly brand-new ship when the Ploesti mission occurred, and this decal set allows you to model it as flown to Ploesti and with several major versions of later markings.
$36.97
1/72 Scale
PYN-up Decals B-24 Ploesti Heroes #1. B-24D-65-CO, 566 BS 389 BG, Fightin’ Sam, Capt. Tom Conroy, Ploesti, Rumania, 1 August 1943; B-24D-70-CO, 513 BS, 376 BG, Wongo Wongo, Lt Brian W. Flavelle, Berka 2, Benghazi, Libya, 1 August 1943.
$27.97
How about some more decals Dave, like my favorite ” Thundermug” and “Brewery wagon” ? Actually, any more aircraft that took part in that historic raid would be nice!
Hi Bob
Extremely good idea. I’m considering it right now.
Dave
Yes!!! Let’s keep asking for BREWERY WAGON and THUNDERMUG,AND WE JUST MAY GET RESULTS.Thank you for asking also.
Hi Garet
Brewery Wagon is definite (provided I decide to do the decals). I’ve got a great color photo of the artwork. I’m considering Thunder Mug (two words), but I’ve only got one photo of the nose art and it’s extremely poor quality.
I’m also considering quite a few other TIDAL WAVE ships.
In fact, I’ve spent 30 hours yesterday and today (yep, 15 hours each day, and my eyes are really crossed now) organizing B-24 photos. I have way more than 5000 B-24 photos, though obviously only a small subset of them are TIDAL WAVE veterans. I should mention that I do not consider any aircraft that turned back from the mission a TW veteran, regardless of whether they got sortie credit. Nonetheless, I’ve got at least one photo of about 150 B-24s that accomplished the mission. Some of the photos are really excellent and some really poor. I’ve got at least another 15 hours work to sort through this group to pick the ones I want to memorialize in decal form. Then of course we have to get all the decal artwork done, the sets printed, etc., etc.
I will probably do all the group commander aircraft–
EXCEPT BAKER’S HELL’S WENCH
. I’d love to include the 93rd’s command ship but I’ve never seen a photo of the plane and can’t find a pic on the internet or in any of the dozens of books I have on the subject. I know several decal companies and at least one artist have portrayed this ship and I’d love to know where they got their photos. Can you help with this?
A number of other crews had especially remarkable experiences at Ploesti and I’m considering these as possible subjects. Finally, you know how much I love fancy nose art so I’m looking at the ships that carried great artwork too.
Dave
You aware of the National Guard painting of Hell’s Wench? I have no idea if it’s accurate. Not much nose art.
Hi Chris
Yes, but the problem is that only artistic renderings of what Hell’s Wench “might” have looked like exist. I’m not convinced the ship actually carried artwork because it was the second NEWEST B-24D to participate in the TIDAL WAVE attack. It arrived in North Africa with a replacement crew less than two weeks prior to the mission, which didn’t leave a lot of time for nose art to be applied–especially during such a busy time.
Of course, some combat aircraft received nose art (some of it quite fancy) before leaving the United States, the crew believing they’d actually fly that specific ship in combat. Unfortunately for nearly all of them, the plane was taken away once they arrived at their operational unit and given to a more experienced crew. This may have been the case with Hell’s Wench, but nobody–literally nobody–knows for sure.
Careful examination of 93rd Bomb Group archives, photo albums, and veterans’ diaries and reminiscences reveal literally nothing about this ship. No photos. No descriptions of nose art. In fact, no mention of this specific ship having any name whatsoever until after the mission. I cannot pin down where the name was originally noted, or by whom.
You probably know IPMS-Columbus included decals for Hells’ Wench in their IPMS-USA Nationals decal sheet from the 1990s. That sheet shows the name in two completely different arrangements. One is simply both words on a single line. The other is the more commonly seen version with “Hell’s” written in an arc over “Wench,” which is on a straight line. Checking with a couple of people tangentially involved in that project indicates nobody there knew what the nose art looked like or even whether any nose art was carried.
Dave Klaus
I hope you will, I always had special interest for Tidal Wave. I have been looking for a long time for decals in 1/48 for a/c that made it back to Libya, in both color ( od and ds ) Let me know if and when you do go ahead with it, i will be among the first to buy it.
I’m with pierre on that one. Come on Dave, let’s have lots of Tidal Wave Decals, they’re sure to be a best seller with the additional interest that all your hard work has raised for the mission.
Hi John
I’m still considering it. Agreed, it’s a very good idea.
Dave
Love the decals.
I would like to see in 1/72 and 1/48 scale.
“Lady Be Good”
Any possible chance?
Regards,
Dave
Hi Dave
Thanks for your kind comment. Lady Be Good is a good idea, although of course she was lost before the TIDAL WAVE mission. I’ve seen photos of the crash site that claim to show the nose art (name), but I could never actually see it in them. Have you seen pics that show the style of the name?
Dave
Dave…..
The name “Lady Be Good” was done in script on the aircraft right side only and in white color. the number 64 was also in script (not block) so finding decals is almost impossible. Decals have to be special made (I’m willing to buy 1/72 scale). The numbers on the tail were block black. Overall the Lady was pretty non-descript with no fancy art work what so ever. Her basic paint scheme was desert sand (not pink) and grey undersides.
Hi Dave
As you know, Lady Be Good was not a TIDAL WAVE/Ploesti veteran, having been lost prior to 1 Aug 43. I’ve seen photos of the wreck and there’s some suggestion the name may have been in yellow rather than white. What is your source for the white color? Agreed the script aircraft numbers are a problem to replicate; I’m going to release a number of TIDAL WAVE decal markings sets in the next few months. Unfortunately it won’t include LBG for obvious reasons, but you might find other useful markings on some of the sheets.
Dave Klaus
I am looking for decals in 1/48th for Henderson’s plane, “4Q2” from the 44th “Flying Eight Balls. is there such a set? Or will I have to make it up on my own? Thanks-Dan G.
Hi Dan
I just discovered that my http://www.Low-Level-Ploesti.org website stopped sending me alerts that somebody has posted a comment. Your interesting note from four months ago (!) has unfortunately fallen into that category, for that I apologize–I have no idea why my alerts stopped. Please be assured that my lack of response does not indicate a lack of interest!
You’ll have to make your own, but luckily the markings are VERY simple. My photos are currently in deep storage while I’m selling my current house and moving to a new place, but I’m certain the only markings were “4 Q 2″ in 6” thin-stroke white letters on the nose and the code letter “G” in white on both outsides of the vertical fins (in addition to the national markings and yellow serial number, of course).
I can’t recall off the top of my head, but the ship may well have had the 44th Bomb Group’s “Flying Eightballs” insignia on the left side of the nose (only). I know my photos show whether it was present, so if you can’t find this elsewhere let me know and I’ll confirm when I get access to my pics again. As a 67th BS ship the nose of the bomb would have been yellow, the squadron color. This marking has been very primitively produced by a couple of decal manufacturers over the years, but would not be hard to hand paint.
Again, sorry about the long delay in answering your note.
Dave
How about the decals for “Sad Sack” SS# 42-40208
Hi Carl
I’ll certainly consider it. We’re going to make some 1/48 & 1/72 TIDAL WAVE decal sets in the next few months, so stay tuned.
Dave
Does anyone make decals for the B-24H planes that Col. James M. Stewart flew? Specifically, ‘Nine Yanks And A Jerk’ and ‘Maie Call’. Please let me know if you are going to make them in the near future.
Thank you, sir.
John Reisinger
Hi John
Iliad Designs made 1/72 decal markings for “Nine Yanks And A Jerk” and “Male Call” (not Maie Call), but I’m not sure they’re still available. I have no idea how accurate the markings are. I am not aware of anybody that’s done them in 1/48, but of course there’s no 1/48 B-24H kit anyway.
Dave
Likewise another Ploesti Raider follower of interest,who would like to see you produce ”BREWERY WAGON” in both 1/72 and 1/48. PLEASE?
Another vote for Brewery Wagon here and may be Chattanooga Choo Choo in 1/48 and 1/72
Hi Jerry
Brewery Wagon is a definite; CCC still in consideration. I’ve got excellent b/w & color photos of Brewery Wagon, and the decal artwork really matches the photos.
Thanks for letting me know.
Dave
Dave
What color do I need to paint my B-24 model to be the color that the B-24s of the 98/344 were painted. They were stationed in Benghazi.
Thanks
Carl Root Jr.
Hi Carl
Good to hear from you!
Technically the color was named 49 Sand; the closest FS 595 match is 30279. This paint faded quite badly in the desert (as did the 41 Dark Olive Drab of the green B-24Ds) so the “visual” color on your ship would almost certainly have been lighter than 30279. This would have depended, in part, on how long the ship had been in the desert and what kind of wear-and-tear it had experienced during that time.
The tan B-24Ds were typically described as “pink,” which unfortunately does not come across in color photos or slides from the era. Since we can’t actually see the “pink” color, it’s hard to say exactly what it tended to look like. The odd thing about the “pink” is that the paint clearly contained a red component (obviously the 30279 color has some red in it), and red normally fades much faster than most other pigments in harsh sunlight. On that basis we’d expect the desert ships to fade more towards yellowish than reddish, but that’s not what the guys who were there described.
Don’t forget the desert got quite muddy when it rained (no drainage) and a LOT of the 9th Air Force Libs had considerable mud coloration on the sides and behind and above the landing gear. It was unheard of for a plane to be washed in the desert, except for the minor “cleaning” they got flying through rain squalls. Check photos of the ship you’re modeling to see how extensive it was on this particular airplane.
If I was painting a 98th model for myself I’d probably start with a 30279 (49 Sand) base and gradually lighten it up the fuselage and fin sides to a slightly more chalky version, which I’d also apply to all the horizontal surfaces that would have received the direct sunlight. Because of the scale color effect (not everybody believes in this, but I do because you can clearly see it with your own eyes), I’d make a 1/72 model a little lighter than a 1/48 model.
Don’t forget that I’m working on a BUNCH of 98th decal markings in 1/48 and 1/72 in my TIDAL WAVE series of to-be-released decal sets. I’m extremely pleased with the way the artwork is coming along, and am certain these will be the most accurate TW decals ever released–by a long shot.
Hope this is useful.
Dave
Hi Dave,
I just got a fantastic deal on a Hasegawa 1/72 B-24D. It’s the original release with The Squaw in her later war bond tour markings. Not my cup of tea. I’d dearly like to do this model as a Tidal Wave a/c from Kane’s 98th for the 75th anniversary this coming August. I don’t really trust the available decals on the market so I’m turning to you and your vast expertise and resources. Do you thing you’ll have some of your new decals available in 2018?
All the best on your DVD and research. It’s long overdue for a proper tribute to the greatest bombing mission of all time. Best of Luck!
William Reece
Hi William
Yes, I’m doing The Squaw in her TW markings, along with about 30 other TW B-24s and several Bf 109Gs and IAR-80/81s that intercepted the Libs that day. We’ve made very good progress on the artwork and I’m extremely pleased with the way the ones we’ve finished so far have turned out, unfortunately I can’t release decal sets on a periodic basis. This is because I’ve got to combine subjects based on popularity and the colors used in the artwork for sales and cost reasons.
I expect we’ll release these decal sets (1/48 & 1/72) during the first quarter of 2018, certainly before next summer. This is a huge project, especially since on quite a few of these ships we’ve broken new ground in the marking research. Many (not all) will have photo-realistic nose art markings, which also takes considerable time.
Dave
Dave,
That’s great news and especially so regarding the Bf 109Gs and IARs in 1/48. The fighter defenders of Ploesti are usually ignored or given only a brief treatment. With the new Bf 109G kits available having the opportunity to build something a bit different but very important will be a treat.
I’m waiting with anticipation and will begin work on my B-24 as one of Killer Kane’s pink ships. Building a B-24 even in 1/72 scale is quite a project. Having had several sets of your former Cutting Edge decals I know the research and quality will be top notch. I simply cannot imagine the work and hours you’ve invested in the decals let alone your entire Tidal Wave project. All the best to you.
Regards,
William Reece
Hi William
Thanks for your kind comments.
The more I think about the “pink” B-24 descriptions, the more I suspect (without being able to confirm) they were more hyperbole than reality.
Consider the Army’s dress uniform during World War II, which was colloquially called “pink & greens” (note too the Army is thinking about bringing this uniform back!). The “pinks,” as they were commonly termed, consisted of a dark olive green jacket and khaki shirt, tie, and trousers. The “pink” described the khaki uniform parts, which were anything but “pink” to the normal color acuity eye.
If the khaki uniform was termed “pink,” it’s not much of a stretch to think they applied the same term to sand colored B-24s, which were also not pink, at least to start with.
On the other hand, I recall interviewing a 44th veteran of the desert deployment back in the early 1980s who said the sand B-24s did in fact appear pink, so maybe my speculation above is incorrect. Recall the 44th and their green airplanes was co-located with the 98th and their sand colored ships, so this guy was in a position to observe them for a month and a half. There are probably other eyewitness accounts that assert the sand colored ships really looked pink, so what the hell.
Paint your model some shade of sand to sandy pink and nobody can argue with you!
Dave
Dave,
I’ve often wondered about that as well. You’d think a pink B-24 would stand out like the proverbial sore thumb especially over the ocean or Italy much less eastern Europe in the summer! The color is quite often referred to as ‘Titty Pink’ in written accounts. Your statement earlier about red fading the fastest in intense sunlight is exactly what I’ve experienced. Red often bleaches to near white given enough sun exposure. Without knowing the exact pigments though it’s difficult to say one way or another how it may have weathered in the Libyan sun.
Lifecolor has FS30279 (UA89) that should be close to #49 Sand. It’s easy to see how given the circumstances it could be considered pink especially when compared to the Olive Drab #41 aircraft of the 44th and 93rd BGs. As you state the uniform of times was called ‘pinks’ and not what today we’d call khaki. It all could have been one of perception rather than an actual pink. I notice that the new line of AK Interactive Real Colors has a one called British Desert Pink that I suppose is for the SAS ‘Pink Panther’ recon vehicles. These new paints are quite interesting.
https://ak-interactive.com/product/british-desert-pink-zi/
My ancient bottle of Floauil FS30279 is a solid blob in the jar so I’ll be on the lookout for something suitable.
Regards,
William
Hi William
I was in the UK in 1973 and got to see one of the SAS pink panther Land Rovers up close. That color was distinctly pink and not one I’d ever consider putting on a B-24. The Brits also had a pink aircraft paint during WW II that was apparently used on some very high altitude recce ships. Once again, this color was distinctly pink and would never be confused for a “sand” color.
Dave
Dave,
I see what you mean after doing a little digging in my chips and painted color cards. The ‘Pink Panther’ color is very pink. Very much as it is discussed being used on the Long Range Desert Group patrol Chevrolet trucks and Jeeps. PINK! I found that Humbrol 250 Desert Sand is matched to FS30279 and probably an acceptable starting point is in my paint stash.
https://www.humbrol.com/us-en/250-desert-sand-matt-14ml-enamel-paint.html
I did notice that the new AK Interactive Real Color line does have a match for FS30279 Desert Sand;
https://ak-interactive.com/product/desert-sand-fs-30279/
Thanks again for your valued input.
Best,
William
Looks good. I think you have what you need to kick this off.
Dave
If any two aircraft need decal sets it would be The Sandman 98th and Utah Man 93rd. Both iconic aircraft in the mission. I have artwork for both. Also suggest Pudgy of the 93rd BG
Hi Glenn
Decal artwork for The Sandman and Utah Man is already complete! Unfortunately Pudgy did not score high enough on the voting to make the cut, but two out of three ain’t bad!
Thanks for your suggestions.
Dave Klaus
Let me know when available. I need 1/48. I have 1 each autographed by the pilots who flew them.
Hi Glenn
One decal set is already available (available separately in 1/48 & 1/72) on my scale models decal sets website http://www.FineArtOfDecals.com (see page http://fineartofdecals.com/goodies/b-24-liberator-pb4y-privateer-treasures/). This set includes two subjects: Brian Flavelle’s 376th Bomb Group Wongo Wongo (inaccurately claimed to have been the mission leader), and the 389th Bomb Group’s striking Uncle Sam.
Not yet released are the 32 additional TIDAL WAVE B-24Ds (all in both 1/48 & 1/72) voted most popular in the survey I ran on this website several months ago, nor the Luftwaffe and Romanian Bf 109Gs, Bf 110s, and Romanian IAR-80/81s that intercepted the attackers.
As a special bonus, I’ll be including marking for the RAF High Speed Launch (HSL 166) that rescued the Hadley’s Harem crew from the Turkish coast after their crash just offshore. It turns out the Airfix 1/72 HSL kit is the correct version, so this will be in easy and interesting model.
Dave
Yes! I’m very interested in the Me 109’s and IAR-80/81. Are the 109’s G-6’s?
Well, sort of “yes.” One.
The 109s that actually participated in the TIDAL WAVE defense were all Bf 109 G-2s and G-4s, and I’ll be including 1/48 & 1/72 decals for several of them flown by German and Romanian pilots. G-6s didn’t appear permanently in Romania until a few months after TIDAL WAVE.
However, I’m also going to include the famous “American Flag” Bf 109 G-6 flown by Cantacuzino when he carried Lt Col Gunn in the radio compartment from Romania to Italy to organize the rescue of the American POWs (including many TIDAL WAVE veterans) at the time the Romanians surrendered to the Allies and changed sides. Technically this was not a TIDAL WAVE veteran aircraft, but since it was instrumental in starting the process of getting the American and British former POWs out of Romania and back to their units, and the markings are so cool, I made the executive decision to include it.
Dave
Will these sets be out any time soon? The 75th Anniversary is at hand.
We’re still working on them, and are well aware the 75th is nearly upon us! Artwork for 20 B-24Ds is complete but we still have 11 more to finish before the sheets can be sent off to printing.
Dave
Thanks Dave. I think I’ve got a 1/48 G-2/4 around here in my stash. I’d be very interested in a Luftwaffe 109 and of course an IAR which is a beautiful airplane. I just wish the Hobby Boss kit was a bit better. Still the IAR is one of those planes that looks fast even when sitting still.
William
When can we expect to see Capt. Bill Cameron’s “Buzzin’ Bear” become available?
Hi David
The two 1/72 decal sets (30 TIDAL WAVE B-24Ds in two nose art decal sets, plus one double-sheet set of so-called “common” markings like stars and RAF fin flashes) went to the decal printing company two weeks ago. I hope to have the printed sheets back by early October and will be able to ship soon after that. This includes Buzzin’ Bear/Miss Dolores (yes, Miss Dolores was on the left side nose of Buzzin’ Bear–I have photographic proof!).
1/48 scale nose art decals for the ships not already released will hopefully go to the printer around the end of this year or early next year, depending on several factors. All TW B-24Ds will eventually be available in both 1/72 and 1/48
Dave
A good friend of mine was copilot to Don O’Sullivan on the B-24D #41-24310 ‘Patches’ on the 1st Aug 43 Ploesti oil refinery raid.
The airplane was a squadron mate of the ill-fated ‘Lady Be Good”
I have a 1/72 kit of the B-24D which I intend to build as a remembrance.
Any chance to get decals for this A/C in 1/72? Or for 1/48?
Hi Larry
You lucky guy! Very few have had the honor of personally knowing a TIDAL WAVE veteran.
Unfortunately all the artwork for my decals project is complete and there wasn’t enough interest shown in the survey I ran to include Patches.
I don’t have great photos of Patches, but it looks like the “62” was the same or basically the same on both sides of the nose (very unusual in the 376th!), and the only artwork was the simple name “Patches” in black, or possibly dark blue, and the missions board in black or dark blue with light colored mission stars. On every other 376th ship I’ve seen the stars were white, but based on the photocopied photo I have (with due acknowledgement that photocopied photos are problematic!), the stars on Patches look like they might have been some combination of light colors, possibly white and yellow–but don’t take this to the bank.
This would be relatively simple to draw up on a computer and print on decal paper. If you don’t feel like you’ve got the computer skills, try posting your need on the forum at http://www.Hyperscale.com, the world’s largest scale modeling website.
Dave
I’d like to see some 24D’s from the Pacific Theater. Any plans for that?
Hey Brian
At the moment I’m up to my eyeballs with Mediterranean B-24s and especially finishing up my TIDAL WAVE book and documentary, so I won’t have time to create any Pacific Libs markings for a while. However, there was some great B-24D nose art on Pacific birds, so this is a great idea that I’ll consider in the future.
You probably already know that I’ve created 1/48 & 1/72 specialist decal markings for a couple of Pacific B-24s, which you can see on my model airplane decals website at https://fineartofdecals.com/goodies/b-24-liberator-pb4y-privateer-treasures/. While neither is a B-24D, both are quite famous. One is an F-7A (B-24J-1-CO) named Hangover Heaven (natural metal scheme after the original blue camo was stripped off), and the other is B-24J-120-CO Madame PELE in the OD over Neutral Gray camo scheme.
Dave
I recently obtained the Hobby Boss B-24D in 1/32nd scale. From the research I did and using the excellent information you have compiled I recognized that the decals that come with the kit aren’t consistent with what is in the box. The decals included are for Wongo Wongo 42-40563. The kit comes with a ventral sperry ball turret. From what I was able to find, the manned sperry ball turret was not installed on B-24Ds until B-24D-140-CO 42-40965,
Besides the other issues with this kit, there aren’t any provisions to back date or convert this to an aircraft without the ventral turret. Other issues are the lack of ventral scanning windows and the tunnel gun position, some have complained about the shape of the nose, and one issue that everyone seems to overlook about this kit is the framed dorsal turret…It looks more like a turret off of a B-17 than a Martin turret.
I can probably scratch build/fill the hole where the sperry turret goes, and cut out the scanning windows and create a tunnel position to get a TW aircraft.
I appreciate the amount of research you have done on the Tidal Wave aircraft, but I was wondering if you have found any information on specific aircraft that were built AFTER the sperry turret was included in production, Or if there is any information on aircraft that had the sperry turret added retroactively. The only thing I was able to find was a B-24D 41-11836 “Lil De-Icer of the 404th Squadron, 28th BG, 11th AF. Given
the serial number, it was obviously retrofitted with a sperry turret.
Any other information you might be able to share would be greatly appreciated
Thanks
Hi Jonathan
Sorry about the long delay in responding. I’ve just returned from my Dad’s funeral in a different state.
You’re right that Wongo did not have a ball turret. Since one was never installed, you’ll need to scratch-build a cover for the kit turret opening that conforms to the fuselage bottom curvature. Maybe some enterprising resin conversion company will produce a part to make this a lot easier!!
Don’t forget that Wongo was one of the relatively few 98th ships to be modified in Africa with two fixed .50 guns underneath the nose floor, exactly similar to those factory-installed on many of the first operational B-24D-COs assigned to HALPRO and the 404th Bomb Squadron in Alaska. Wongo’s flexible nose .50 was installed in the lower greenhouse socket before and on TIDAL WAVE, as was typical of 9th Air Force Liberators (8AF Libs ususally mounted the nose greenhouse .50 in the upper socket). Remember an N-7 bombsight (modified N-6 fighter gunsight) was used on TW. Since the small N-7 “looked ahead” rather than “down,” the flexible .50 in the lower mount was no problem and allowed an additional gun to use against ground targets at low level.
I assume you’re referring to the ventral scanning windows located near the rear crew entry hatch and not the field-installed additional ventral scanning windows located by the position where the awful Bendix remote belly turret had been installed on the first few B-24D-COs (but not on later -COs nor any subsequent Blocks). Wongo did not have the “remote belly turret” scanning windows, although quite a few 8th and 9th Libs did. For a long time I thought these additional windows were an 8th-only mod, but photos show some 9th ships received them too–but again, NOT Wongo.
Also, it turns out we need to be careful about published information that ball turrets were not installed until Block 140. Al Blue, in his seminal 1976 book The B-24 Liberator, A Pictorial History, stated the turrets started at this block, but recall that book was written more than 45 years ago. Al was an honest and precise historian, and his post-publication research suggested these turrets started well before Block 140, as he informed me several times.
Many 389th Bomb Group Libs deployed to the desert for TIDAL WAVE arrived with ball turrets installed, although they were removed prior to the TW mission (whether they were reinstalled before deployment to the UK is an open question!). All but a couple 389th ships were in the Block 80, 90, 95, and 100 series.
While we don’t know for sure which specific ships had the ball turrets, we do know for sure that 389th B-24D-90-CO, 42-40722, The Little Gramper, and B-24D-90-CO, 42-40738, The Oklahoman, both had a ball turrets. This rather strongly suggests the Block 90 ships all had the turrets, which also suggests the 389th’s Block 95 and Block 100 ships did too.
Note that if you’re modeling one of the 389th ships with the ball turret removed, the proper cover was a simple flat disk bolted over the hole through which the ball turret projected. This is a much simpler modification than that required to model a ship that never had a BT installed.
Last, not sure what source claims B-24D-CO 41-11836 Lil’ De-Icer was assigned to the 404th–it was of course assigned to the 415th Bomb Squadron, 98th Bomb Group, and was a TIDAL WAVE veteran. It did not have a ball turret at any point.
Sorry to hear about your father Dave. I know how you must feel, My father passed away in 1999 and there isn’t a day that goes by that I don’t think of him.
Thanks for the feed back and wanted to let you know I got the second set of decals yesterday. I am looking forward to the release of your book. I am sure you are very familiar with the Dugan and Stewart account of the events of 1 Aug 1943. I wanted to get your take on their narrative. I first red the book when I was 13 in 1969, and read it again sometime around 1980 and have just finished reading it again a couple of days ago. How well (in your opinion) does it stand up to current information that may have been obtained since they published the book in 1962?
Also, for any modelers who might be interested, I was able to source new nose and tail turrets for the 1/32nd scale Hobby Boss B-24 Ds and B-24 Js. Cold War Studios in Bulgaria produces some absolutely fantastic replacements in clear resin, which takes care of the annoying seam in the middle of those parts, It would be nice if someone could figure a way to get this kind of quality in 1/48th scale though.
Anyway, here is the website for them. They are in Bulgaria. I ordered the set around the middle of June and got them two weeks later, here is the website
https://coldwarstudio.com/Resin%20Detail%20Sets%201/32%20scale%20category/
Again thanks for providing us all with excellent decals and reference matieral
Hi Jonathan
Again, thanks for your kind comments.
Dugan & Stewart earned their place in history as the first seminal reporters of Operation TIDAL WAVE. They did a superb job of gathering participants’ war stories; the bulk of their research was done between about 1956 and 1960, which was 13-18 years after the event. By and large, the guys’ memories were a LOT clearer then than when many wrote or were interviewed in the ’80s and ’90s.
ALSO–and this is a crucial point–Cal Stewart interviewed the men prior to them “reading the Dugan and Stewart book.” When I interviewed several dozen TW participants in the late ’70s and early ’80s I was initially shocked to hear so many tell me a story, then pause and say “You know, Dave, I’m not sure whether I really remember that or read it in the book” (meaning Dugan and Stewart).
This happened again and again. I learned first-hand an important lesson that is old news to police detectives: five people can witness the same traffic accident and give six completely different stories about what happened.
Human memory is highly fallible and subject to influence by factors unrelated to valid facts. This is not speculation; it’s extremely well documented throughout human history across many countries and types of human experiences. This does not mean no eyewitness accounts are accurate or valid—just that an individual’s account must be viewed with circumspection.
The human brain seeks to understand what the eyes see and ears hear, and when explicit information is missing the brain tends to “fill in the blanks” with what it considers logical and reasonable…which sometimes turns out to be neither. Also, what one “sees” is highly susceptible to factors unrelated to “normal” observation such as stress, duration, distance, viewing angle, atmospheric obscurants, etc.
And sometimes people simply lie.
I observed another phenomenon of human memory back then at literally every bomb group reunion I attended. Unlike a fighter pilot or any other single combatant, TW bomber crews consisted of nine, ten, or eleven men, where in some cases more than one man saw the same event. What one man mis-remembered others could sometimes modify or correct.
One story in particular stands out in my memory. I was sitting with five members of one TW crew at a unit reunion banquet. The top turret gunner/flight engineer was very excited to tell me about his TIDAL WAVE experience.
He said that during the attack he was kneeling on the fuselage spar just behind the pilots’ seats when the pilot suddenly and violently pushed the ship’s nose down, which caused him to fly up into the air, then the pilot immediately and violently pulled the nose back up, causing him to crash back down onto the spar. He hit so hard his knees left two indentations on the spar, which remained there for the rest of their missions.
Cool—what a great “human interest” story for me use about one man’s experience on TIDAL WAVE!
Not so fast, grasshopper.
At the end of his story, ALL the other four crewmembers present almost yelled—“NO! That wasn’t Ploesti, that was at Wiener Neustadt, two weeks later!”
The flight engineer looked down and said, “Damn. You’re right. I’ve been telling that story wrong for 45 years! Now I’ve lost my best damned Ploesti story and have to come up with a new one…”
I relate this information not to impugn TW eyewitness reports but to remind people that such individual reports are not gospel. In fact, because in many cases multiple men saw the same event and were able to discuss it during the flight home, some eyewitness reports from the Ploesti mission are likely to be more accurate than reports of individual combat elsewhere.
I do not suggest that eyewitnesses usually lie or are mistaken—only that their stories tend to be approximations of what actually transpired.
So: Dugan and Stewart did a great job of capturing the “I was there” stories of TW participants.
The weaknesses in their book, which are in no way their fault, come from the fact they presented the best public information about structural matters publicly available at the time.
Two crucial and foundational sources of what really happened at Ploesti were completely unavailable and unknown to them. There was no way they could have known the conventional TW story was rather wildly inaccurate absent this decisive information.
First was the closed “old boy” network of senior TIDAL WAVE officers who soon after achieved flag officer rank (became generals). They knew what happened but simply did not discuss it outside their little circle, which included Generals Ted Timberlake, Leon Johnson, Jack Wood, Jacob Smart, George Brown, Keith Compton, and perhaps a couple others.
It did not include Uzal Ent, the mission commander, who died in 1948 from complications due to his incompetent 1944 B-25 takeoff from Tucson. Neither did it include John Kane, the former 98th Bomb Group commander, who was generally treated as a pariah by the rest of the TIDAL WAVE senior officers after the mission.
General Smart’s son told me many stories about growing up around so many famous military aviators who were friends of his father. His dad generally let him sit in on bull sessions at their home—with one exception. When the other senior TIDAL WAVE officers visited, they always disappeared behind his dad’s closed office door. Gen Compton’s children told me a similar story. Clearly these discussions were not for uninitiated ears.
(So, when General Johnson asked me in 1985, “Dave, do you want to know what really happened at Ploesti,” I was all ears. Each of those “inner circle” officers flew in different planes, but they had intimate, first-hand knowledge of the preparations and privately discussed the mission for years.)
Why was this inner circle so closed-mouth? The primary reason was undoubtedly loyalty. It’s difficult (or impossible) for most people today to understand how strong was the sense of loyalty to the Army and to each other among 1920s and 1930s West Point graduates. Related to this general sense of loyalty was Army chief of staff General George Marshall’s ironclad dictum that no dishonor was to be brought on the Army by actions of senior officers. Every West Pointer knew this, and it held sway through at least the middle of the war.
Two good examples of Marshall’s unwritten law were Maj Gen Lloyd Fredendall, II Corps commander during the February 1943 battle of the Kasserine and our own Brig Gen Uzal Ent, TIDAL WAVE mission commander.
Both men committed what were considered acts of cowardice in the face of the enemy, but neither was publicly fired or even censured. Fredendall was returned to the US and promoted to one more star (to lieutenant general) and assigned to command a training army. Ent too was returned to the US, promoted to an additional star (to major general) and given command of a training air force.
(Interestingly, while abject failures as combat commanders, both were successful in the training role. Ent, in particular, was extremely successful at turning around the failed B-29 aircrew training program, and was highly lauded for that by Hap Arnold during and after the war. My personal opinion, which is based on inadequate research on my part, is that Ent’s success in fixing B-29 crew training was due far more to his exceptionally competent chief of training, Col Keith Compton, than his own competence, but this is a matter for additional study.)
The second burden unknown to Dugan and Stewart was the inaccuracy and/or unavailability of crucial official documentation. In short, the infamous 1944 official USAAF account of TIDAL WAVE was a lie, and the Axis documentation was either behind the Iron Curtain or had been largely destroyed during the war. A surprising amount of Axis documentation actually survived the war but was essentially buried in American, British, and German archives at the time and therefore unavailable to Stewart.
It’s fair to say that Dugan and Stewart did yeoman work at gathering personal accounts of the preparation, attack, and aftermath. But because they were excluded from crucial information from both sides, they were severely limited in their ability to accurately describe most of what really happened to the attacking units and defenders, the immediate and long-term effects, and ultimate effect on the war effort. Not their fault—the information was not available to them. I have the highest regard for their dedication, their research, and their storytelling.
Finally, it’s worth noting that since Dugan and Stewart’s book was published literally every book about TIDAL WAVE is essentially a restatement of their work. In fact, one famous author plagiarized entire paragraphs and pages from Dugan and Stewart to complement his collection of photographs.
The single exception known to me is Roger Freeman’s Ploesti Through The Lens. Roger was a superb military aeronautics historian with deep access to relevant resources and a fine analytical mind. He attempted, within the confines of his book’s structure, to look at some of the issues not covered by Dugan and Stewart. While I don’t necessarily agree with all his analyses, his work is well worth reading.
Hope this is useful.
Dave
Thanks for the exhaustive insight!
I completely understand the tricks the human mind can play on a person’s memory. I was in the Marine Corps for 4.5 years and Crewed CH-46s and later in the Army for 17.5 years and was a Flight Engineer on CH-47s.
After I retired I worked investigating ground and aviation accidents for about 16 years, so I know how the same incident can be perceived by different people at different times.
As far as the “Good Old Boy” / “Ring Knocker” system goes, I understand how that works as well. It was my experience (1975-1997) in the military that graduates of Annapolis and West Point made either very good or very bad officers, there didn’t seem to be any mediocre ones…of course that was just my own personal experience. But it fits with your narrative.
In the late 80s there was much rhetoric about the NCO Corps, I observed and made it known to my Company and Battalion Commanders, First Sergeant and Sergeant Major one night where alcohol was being consumed, that the NCO Corps that they were droning on and on about was nothing more or less than exactly what the Officer Corps wanted it to be. I was no one’s favorite NCO after that.
When I retired in 97 There was still a sense of loyalty to others who had shared experiences…I don’t know if that same feeling still exists from anyone in the military now.
Anyway, your insight is much appreciated and I am looking forward to your book.
I ran across your Tidal Wave presentation on YT. My great uncle, Arnold Holen was on that fateful mission and was KIA. He was on Lt Roy Harms B24, named from what I understand “Hell’s Angel”. They were part of the 93rd Bomb Group and I have the squadron and aircraft tail number but not handy at the moment. I have never seen any nose art of that aircraft and don’t know if it actually had any. I have two pictures of the crew in front of a B24, with at least one taken in Lincoln, Nebraska from what I was told before deploying overseas.
I ran across the Dugan and Stewart book and read it while stationed in Korea during my Air Force career. From that book and the “censored” information my mom had from when he was reported MIA and later changed to KIA. To this day, his remains are unidentified. Only in the past couple years was Lt Roy Harms’ remains returned to Wisconsin for burial. That “Operation Tidal Wave” book misspells his name, adding a “d” to Holden. Jack Reed was the only survivor of the aircraft.
I would appreciate any and all further information you may have on Lt Harms and his crew, especially pictures or video.
I attached the picture of the crew. My great uncle in second from left in the back row. I also attached a picture of Jack Reed and Arnold Holen. They had become good friends.
Hi Tom
See my direct email. I’ve corrected my version of the TW roster with correct spelling of your great uncle’s name.
DPAA (Defense POW-MIA Accountability Agency) is doing yeoman work on identifying remains of TW crewmen burned beyond recognition in the crashes of their ships in Romania; 49 men’s remains fully identified so far. I hope they’re able to identity Arnold’s remains as well–keep the faith!
BTW, the only photo that uploaded is the one of Arnold and Jack; the crew photo did not upload.
Dave