I’m deep into writing the script for my documentary right now and I need your help. With the massive original research I’ve done at the US National Archives, USAF Historical Research Agency, Air Force Museum, Romanian archives, German Bundesarchiv, British National Archives and Imperial War Museum, interviews with participants, etc., etc., etc., I have FAR more information than could ever fit into a film documentary.
This documentary is for you–since I’ve done the research, obviously I already know the story. The point is that to be useful, this doc must first answer your “burning questions” about the mission. This is literally the most important thing.
What do you want to know about the mission? What interests or perplexes you? This could include the background (or situation), planning, execution, aftermath and/or anything else that interests you.
If you don’t want to enter your questions and comments on the video above, feel free to leave them as a comment by checking the comment box below, or you can email me privately here.
Thanks for your help–remember, this project is for YOUR benefit!
Question:
What happened to the airframes that were interned in Turkey after the raid? Were the bombers repatriated at some time, scrapped or did they become Turkey’s property?
Also, the 376th BG B-24D ‘The Blue Streak’ SN 41-11613 was what got me interested in Ploesti waaaay back in the 1970’s when Revell had a 1/72 scale plastic model kit of it with an awesome (unfortunately erroneous) painting of it flying in the low level Ploesti raid. That one iconic model kit probably is the reason a lot of kids in the 1970’s ever knew about the Ploesti raid, and probably sparked a lot of interest and reading about the raid. Years later because of nostalgia, I consider that kit to be the ‘holy grail’ of my childhood memorabilia. I’ve purchased numerous old sealed kits off eBay through the years, just to sit in our curio cabinet as a reminder of the ‘good old days’. I assume that this plane was in theatre at the time of the raid as it was painted up as ‘1st over Ploesti, Low Level’ 8/1/43′ but I understand it didn’t actually fly in the raid. Why not?
Hi Todd
Good questions, with quite interesting answers.
No, “The Blue Streak” was not a TIDAL WAVE veteran; like quite a few 9th AF (98th & 376th BGs) ships she did not make the mission due to maintenance problems–primarily the lack of rebuilt engines. Of course as one of the original HALPRO ships, TBS was quite a well-used airframe by the time TIDAL WAVE rolled around. The three 8th AF bomb groups had generally better maintenance records in the desert, but of course their ships had been in the desert for only a month and not subject to the harsh desert conditions the 98th & 376th ships had been subjected to for up to a year.
Blue Streak returned to the US for a War Bond tour after TIDAL WAVE and many, many publicity photos were taken so she was quite recognizable and well-known at the time. My Dad, who was an schoolboy on an Illinois farm at the time, actually remembers this specific plane. It’s not surprising Revell latched on to her as for initial release of their 1/72 B-24D kit. Who knows whether anybody at Revell knew she didn’t actually go on TIDAL WAVE?
The old Revell Blue Streak kit certainly plays a major part in my childhood memories too. One of the first kits I ever built, at around the same time I first read Dugan & Stewart’s Ploesti book. Can’t recall the year, but it must have been in the very early ’60s. Maybe somebody knows for sure what year the Revell kit was released.
And, I too picked up up a good quality NOS copy of the kit to put on the shelf, never to be actually built.
My stepson’s great great uncle, T/SGT Utley was on aircraft, 41-11776-Bashful of the 98BG, he was TDY from the 389th BG. In my research I have found that the aircraft crashed killing most of the crew. I do know that the Co-Pilot, Charles Deane Cavit, is still alive as of April 2014 and living in the San Jose area. I would love if you could get that aircrafts story. Some info I have read states they dropped their bombs and some state they never made the target.
Please also add me to any mailing list as I would love to purchase the documentary when complete.
Robert Brooks
Hi Robert
Good to hear from you. I’m already in contact with Mr Cavit’s family, and you’re right, the story of JERSEY JACKASS, formerly named BASHFUL, is quite interesting. As you probably know, McGraw’s crew, including Mr Cavit and T/Sgt Utley, were from the 389th Bomb Group but flying with the 98th BG that day. The official Sortie Report for McGraw’s crew lists S/Sgt rather than T/Sgt as the rank for James Utley. This could have been a typo, or he certainly could have been promoted after the fact.
According to Mr Cavit, they DID drop their bomb with the rest of the 98th. They finally crashed near the town of TĂTĂRANI about 45 miles directly west of Ploesti while they were trying to get home. The only two survivors were Mr Cavit and S/Sgt Jack Ross, the tail gunner. This is confirmed by Romanian documents.
I’ve already added you to the email list for updates to this project; however, anyone else reading this can add themselves by simply filling in their name and email in the “opt-in” box near the top right corner of this page.
My step-father, Maj. Gen. Jack Weston Wood was one of the pilots in the raid. Do you know anything about this wonderful man? He passed away in 1994.
Thank you,
Patricia Burell
Hi Patricia
Yes, Jack Wood was, as an Army Air Force colonel, commander of the 389th Bomb Group on this mission. His unit arrived in North Africa directly from the US only a few weeks before the TIDAL WAVE mission, and for many of his men TIDAL WAVE was their first combat mission. Wood had instilled in his inexperienced men a deep sense of professionalism and discipline that caused them to be, along with the 44th Bomb Group, the only unit that knocked their target completely out of the war.
Brigadier General Uzal Ent, the overall commander of the mission did not fully trust the new 389th flyers to be able to “keep up” with the more experienced aviators of the 9th Air Force in the broad, coordinated attack on the oil refineries in Ploesti city and therefore assigned them to attack the northernmost target, the Steaua Romana refinery at Campina, Romania. Proving Ent’s concerns entirely misplaced, Col Wood and his 389th plastered their target so severely it did not resume production for the rest of the war, which for Romania ended when the Russians occupied the country at the end of August 1944.
I have been extremely impressed by the discipline Col Wood instilled in the men of the 389th. Such discipline happens only by design, not by accident. From contemporary records it is very clear he instituted policies and procedures that ensured his operational and maintenance men, although new to combat, thoroughly knew their jobs and consistently performed at a very high level–an example a couple of the other group commanders on this mission would have done well to emulate.
I’m very glad to hear from you!
Dave Klaus
i was reading through your list of planes that flew this mission. My dad flew on the Witch with Julian Darlington. My dad was the radio operator. They did drop their bombs on the target and were shot down in Yugoslovia. Six of the crew were taken POW. My dad and three other crew members were taken in by Tito’s partisans. They stayed with the partisans for 319 days robbing German trains, destroying power stations and constantly on the move. A British intelligence officer joined the group to gain Intel on the group and discovered my dad and his three crew members. He contacted his intelligence office who in turn contacted the OSS. They finally got a plane in there and flew them out. My dad is the only member of his crew still living. We attended the 70th reunion in Ohio, but he’s 92 and his health has really started to fail since we lost my mom in March. I don’t know if any of this info helps.
Hi Darlena
Great story about your dad! What’s his name?
Thanks for sharing it with the rest of us.
I’ve got a couple of questions, but I’ll contact you direct to ask them.
Dave
My grandfather was a crew member on “The Witch” as well. I was just trying to research about it and this came up. His name was Lloyd W. Brisbi
Hi Melissa
Thanks for connecting! As I’m sure you know, your grandfather was the flight engineer/top turret gunner on Darlington’s crew, flying The Witch that day. Their story is amazing. They were shot down well after leaving the target at Ploesti, by a Bulgarian Bf 109 fighter over western Bulgaria. Darlington was able to miraculously belly-land the stricken plane in a mountain wheat field. The crew survived, but during the crash your grandfather was injured and ended up in a Bulgarian prisoner of war camp and was not liberated until more than a year later.
Dave
Hi, I cannot be sure of exact details of this, but I found out today that my great uncle was killed over Romania. He was a B-24 pilot and might have been part of Operation Tidal wave. His name was John Dyer. I would love to dig deeper and learn more about what he did. If there is any way I could learn more I would really appreciate any insight or research you could provide me. Thank you for this awesome display I am absolutely fascinated with this raid. Thank you.
Randall
Hi John
I already contacted you via email. Thanks for your interest.
Dave
My Uncle volunteered to fly with the 98th that day (he was normally with the 389th) due to a crew member illness. The aircraft was known alternately as the “Damfino” or “Four Eyes” (42-40655) and was in the C section of Kane’s group. Sortie reports confirmed that the aircraft went down (the two witnesses were the tail gunner and waist gunner on Lebrecht’s ship on the other side of the formation). Although declared KIA later, a mother of a crew member (Reitz) was contacted by a soldier after the war who said that he met Reitz, Kraft, Timpco and O’Mara in a POW camp and just stopped by to make sure Reitz made it through the war OK. The conventional wisdom is that they somehow came under the control of the soviets and ended up in a Russian Labor camp. It began a long, difficult road for several of the families to try to determine what really happened, but they received no cooperation from Stalin’s government and little with the US. I’m waiting for the 293 but I’m not sure if they ever even established where the crash site was. I have the sortie reports for the 98th and the MACR for 42-40655 but if there is anyone who knows anything else I would appreciate hearing it. Even an anecdotal record of locals picking up pieces or remains at the crash site would be helpful. I am also looking for the sortie reports of the other bomb groups involved if anyone can point me in the right direction.
My Dad (Howard Wode ) flew in the Aug. 1 1943 mission over the Ploesti area’
He was a B24 waist gunner/bombadier
He was in the 389th that came in from England and landed in Turkey after.
Dad flew 32 total missions.
One of the ships was Munichs Tunic crew 7
Any information you might have would be greatly appreciated.
thanks.
Ron Wode
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Hi Ron
Do you know the name of the pilot he was flying with that day?
Dave
Hi Ron
(Personal information from Ron redacted)
Ah—that explains my problem (which I didn’t want to mention in my first contact with you).
I couldn’t find your Dad’s name in the list of TIDAL WAVE/Ploesti participants created from the “Sortie Reports” written for each plane and crew for each mission flown from North Africa, including the TIDAL WAVE mission of 1 Aug 43. It’s been rumored the Sortie Reports are not 100% correct, although I’ve never seen any evidence of a man’s name being left off the crew listed on the form.
I’m personally relieved to report your additional information confirms your Dad flew against Ploesti during the 1944 “Oil Campaign,” when thousands of bomber and fighter sorties were flown against the oil refineries and other military targets in Romania, particularly in the Ploesti area. Unfortunately the 1944 missions are outside my area of research and I cannot provide additional information about your Dad, his crew, plane, or unit.
That said, it’s important to note the Axis defenses (Flak, fighters, artificial fog) at Ploesti were stronger during the 1944 Oil Campaign than came to bear during the surprise attack on 1 Aug 43 (TIDAL WAVE). Overall American losses were much lower for a number of reasons, particularly the large number of attacking American bombers on each mission, but the missions were still extremely dangerous—perhaps the most dangerous against any target outside Berlin.
I obtained a great deal of TIDAL WAVE material from the US National Archives at College Park, MD (named “Archives II”), and if you contact them it’s likely they will be able to provide at least some info about your Dad and his unit. It’s less likely they’ll have info about the plane, but they’ll do their best to send you what they can find.
It’s also possible your Dad’s “201 File” (his Army Air Force personnel file) still exists at the US National Archives facility in St Louis, MO. I say “possible” because of the large arson fire there in the 1970s that destroyed many thousands of WW II records. Nonetheless, it’s probably useful contacting them anyway since your Dad’s records may have survived. If they did, you can get access to them.
Again, sorry I can’t directly help with info about your Dad, but I hope my suggestions will give you useful avenues to pursue.
Best of luck!
Dave
One thing I would really like to see is some percentages, how much fuel was produced at or near Ploesti and how much was produced at other locations. Some books have had numbers for tons of fuel refined at Ploesti refineries but they don’t say how much was refined at other locations{even in other countries}. I find it hard to explain this but my question really is really about the effect of strategic bombing on the German war effort. What would have happened if there had been no strategic bombing campaign against Germany by Americans? What if Tidal Wave had gone as near to perfection as is realistically possible, no wrong turn, no large gap between the groups, etc. How much damage was POSSIBLE? Books about World War II strategic bombing have rarely said much about the alternatives. Despite problems with fuel the Germans were still able to launch the “Battle of the Bulge” and the problem wasn’t so much LACK of fuel as it was getting the fuel to where it was needed with Allied air cover shooting up Axis supply lines. Did Tidal Wave really make a difference since the bombers didn’t go back for eight months? This is some of what I’ve been wondering about and it sounds like you may have some answers to my questions.
I have some interest in personal stories, too, but a lot of them have been told already. If you have new information about individuals I’m interested in that, too. I’m always curious about the individuals who flew the mission. Who was experienced and who was a recent replacement? The books don’t always tell us that. I’ve done some research, too, and I have an idea about some of those who flew the mission but I could use more information if you have it available.
Hi Chris
I agree completely, and it’s also important to show details about the TYPES, QUALITY, and QUANTITY of products Ploesti produced, along with precisely where those products were shipped, and where consumed.
You’ve hit the nail on the head about the problems of production being exacerbated by truly severe problems of distribution. This problem existed from the start of Barbarossa, but the major distribution impacts really grew from mid-1944 to the end of the war.
Even the important production/distribution distinction is inadequate for understanding the overall petroleum issue. We must also know how much and what types of petroleum products were required at specific places at specific times. For example, the Wehrmacht consumed at least 10 times more fuel when they were on the offensive (moving) vs the same number of units in static defensive positions. This difference is obvious; armies on moving attack consume much more of everything than when not moving.
Part of your question drifts towards what’s termed “counterfactual history;” in plain language, “what might have been” if you’re being charitable, and “fantasy” if you’re not.
I’m not a big fan of counterfactual history because it’s literally unprovable–it didn’t happen that way, and so often disintegrates into the equivalent of “dorm room bull sessions.” Nonetheless, some of what you mention needs to be addressed for the simple reason it comes up so often. I will address some counterfactuals in a separate chapter of my book to clarify the difference between what’s documented and WAGs (wild-assed guesses). This does not make me happy, but I acknowledge that if I don’t address some of these things speculation will only grow.
I also agree with your position on “personal stories,” and will include relevant stories from the Americans AND Romanians AND Germans. Stewart and Dugan had a great opportunity to poll participants just 12-15 years after the event, when memories were much clearer than when I interviewed participants in the late ’70s and early ’80s. That’s why I’m relying almost exclusively on contemporary accounts such as diaries, letters home, etc., along with the personal interviews.
I’ve previously written that it’s potentially easier to get valid participant stories from bomber crews than, say, fighter pilots or infantrymen, because quite often more than one bomber crewman on the same plane experienced the same event and their stories can be cross-checked–particularly when all the surviving crewmembers are together at an event. I saw this happen multiple times when I was interviewing crewmen way back when.
Thanks for your excellent questions and suggestions!
Dave
Dave, while I DO like counterfactual history I want to emphasize that what I’m looking for most from you is CONTEXT. How did the raid fit into the war effort of the countries involved? I was interested to hear you call the mission political. That makes some sense; it was a way to show Stalin that America was doing something. At the same time I would emphasize{as you probably would agree, but for the benefit of anyone reading here who is unaware of it} that Ploesti was the most important non-political target of the war. I say that if it was worth bombing Ploesti at all in 1943 then it was worth doing it at low altitude. Bob Sternfels thought it should have been done at high altitude but I’ve always said that a high altitude mission simply wouldn’t have done enough damage to be worth the cost. I believe it was a good idea at the time. I’ve wondered about the wrong turn and what might have happened if they’d stayed on course. What you say in your CAF video makes sense to me. I’m very much in agreement with you about Kane and what you’ve said about Ent makes sense. I’m getting more excited about your book thinking you may go way beyond what earlier books offered. I’ve been struck by how many books and articles repeat the same errors about the mission but I think maybe you’ve studied it enough{and got into those archives} to get it right where they did not. By the way, are there any of those other books that you think came closer to the truth than others?
Hi Chris
Yes, a LOT of people like counterfactual history. This is understandable because it lets their imagination run wild.
My primarily interest is in the military and political context of the TIDAL WAVE mission. The “war stories” have mostly already been told, particularly in Ploesti, The Great Air-Ground Battle of 1 August 1943 by Cal Stewart and Jim Dugan. They conducted a stunning amount of research among TW veterans in the 1950s and published in 1962.
Whatever I’m able to contribute to the TIDAL WAVE story is possible only because I stand on the shoulders of those two giants. Literally all TW books published since then are derivative of their book, and in at least one case the later author plagiarized whole paragraphs and even whole pages from Stewart/Dugan.
One of the main advantages I have that Cal & Jim did not have is access to formerly classified material from both the Allied and Axis sides. This material gives me the chance to clearly lay out the mission’s context; the backstory goes back at least four years. It also allows me to expose information that existed at the time and may (or may not) have been available to the strategic and tactical planners. In particular, why was the Ploesti mission scheduled for the summer of 1943 when Allied intelligence knew full well Romanian production was falling and in fact the Axis was machine was consuming less fuel than in 1941 and 1942? There is an answer.
Allied planners did not necessarily consider Ploesti the most important non-political target of the time. The “critical” importance of Ploesti was, by early 1943, more of a perpetuation of 1939-40 thinking and awareness than one based on current facts.
The US & British air forces definitely considered the German fighter factories to be of FAR higher importance, and in fact lobbied hard for TIDAL WAVE to be postponed or canceled as late as July 1943 in favor of expanded attacks on the fighter factories. (The fact that the aircraft engine factories were far more critical than the airframe factories to the German war effort was not recognized until after the war.) In addition, the planners clearly understood the synthetic oil plants, which produced perhaps 90% of the high-octane AVGAS, were more important to winning the war, or at least protecting the Reich, than Ploesti. Of course it’s true Ploesti provided considerable “truck/tank” gas to the Eastern Front, which was important in and of itself.
I have many disagreements with Bob Sternfels’ conclusions, but certainly recognize and salute his personal heroism on TIDAL WAVE, where he was one of the very few 98th pilots to drop his bombs near his pinpoint target. My book will cover the 98th’s actual bombing performance in great detail based on the Romanian bombfall charts and damage assessments. Unfortunately, in effect, they might as well have not gone to Ploesti at all for the minimal damage they created.
I’m also going to analyze the early turn (NOT “wrong” turn) at Targoviste in great detail. Some of the evidence is circumstantial, but there’s a LOT of it and I think would stand up in court (but the reader will be able to make his own judgments after seeing the evidence).
The seminal book on TIDAL WAVE is without doubt still the 1962 Stewart/Dugan “textbook.” It’s literally the last word on “I was there” stories, and if they had access to the material available to me today my own effort would be unnecessary. I can’t emphasize enough what a majestic job they did.
Dave